So You’re Gay

verse

Published on July 19, 2004 By stevendedalus In Personal Relationships

Should it matter to the guy who’s straight

To snort and rile the one who’s gay?

“Live and let live” I hear judgment say —

Why ruffle feathers and adjudicate?

To confront a style that does no harm

Is perhaps not human nature’s duty

To march against what’s abnormality

With righteousness and alarm.

Comments (Page 2)

stevendedalus

on Jul 22, 2004

What if God brought Adam and Steve together for a reason? Even though they wouldn't produce much offspring, maybe Adam and Steve would produce good opportunities for us to learn about tolerance, compassion and open mindedness? A God of love would surely sponsor that.

I like this: very touching.

Amitty, bravo! I'm with you in hoping the issue goes away.

AndyBaker

on Jul 22, 2004

The Bible, and all it's good times are on the way out

Don't speak too soon Amitty. As humanity matures and grows more spiritually aware, deeper interpretations of our classic sacred texts are arising. (See my post on the religious thread from about 3 weeks ago, 'Were Adam and Eve created in Heaven?')

Humanity is on a threshold of moving into a new spiritual awakening, in my opinion, and our tolerance and acceptance of gays will be a by-product of that.

Andy

Amitty

on Jul 22, 2004

Steve and Andy, both, thank you.

Steve, unfortunately, I don't think it will "go away', but jsut be more mainstream. Like how rap music survived the mid 90's. But, I hope it does, like you.

Andy: Religion, in my opinion, is like the Flo-bee Hair cutting system: when it was first introduced, it had its target audience and served a purpose for what it was meant to do. Put aside the fact that millions upon millions have been killed in the name of religion, we get back to the ' tolerance' issue.
What right does the religious sector have to condemn ANYONE? Factual basis of the bible and it's teaches lead people to beleive one prospective. Hell, I didn't ask to be gay, and I'm sure I'm not a statisical anomoly. Why is it so hard for people to believe that a man wants to lay with a man? I don't hold a grudge against a religious person because it's something I don't beleive in. I don't automatically vilify people that think different or act different than myself.

So why do people that blindly believe in god have to do it. It's another example of " My Way or the Highway." Rewards are offered for those that tote the company line, and that is good for them. People need a reason to do things. But when people start telling me that I am wrong, that my love for another man is wrong, then the gloves come off.

Tolerance is not cool, because it's putting up with something. Acceptence is the answer.

stevendedalus

on Jul 22, 2004

Perhaps warm tolerance will lead to at least cool acceptance.

Amitty

on Jul 22, 2004

let's hope so!

AndyBaker

on Jul 22, 2004

But when people start telling me that I am wrong,

... don't take it to heart, and let them get on with their own misguided attitudes. Other people don't have to hurt you if you don't let them. It's all in the mind.

Tolerance is not cool, because it's putting up with something. Acceptence is the answer.

I couldn't agree with you more dude. Nice one.

Andy

SanctusBelle

on Jul 22, 2004

I don't automatically vilify people that think different or act different than myself.

So why do people that blindly believe in god have to do it. It's another example of " My Way or the Highway."

Here's the thing... God's way is the only way. It sounds like you don't believe in God, Amitty. Of course He wants us to love each other. However, He would want us to help eachother through sinful natures as well. We're all sinners, and we all need help.
If you had a friend with a drug problem, and you could see they were on the path of death and destruction, you would call them out on that. The Bible says, "The wages of sin is death." When I see a brother or sister on the path to Hell, I want to help them. I want to tell them of a God and Saviour who is loving and forgiving and who transforms our lives and this world.

Amitty

on Jul 22, 2004

How do you know god is real? Because a book told you? Because you believe it in your heart?

So, being a sinner, you would like? Suggest a ex-gay camp, tell me to take christ into my heart? You knowwhat would help..just accpeting that people do things, that people are a certain way. Have you never done something against god's will? That is what I would like to know...even unpure thoughts require the confessional.
Shouldi try to embrace the light?
I have had a tough life, there are others that have had it tougher. What has God done for them? When people tell others to 'embrace god', because he will be their saviour. When God doesn't show up, it's because ' God is letting people figure it out.' How does that juxtiposition work? If it's good, it's god? if it's bad, it's evil old human nature? Satan? Osama?

Have you talked to God? Has he done something for you? Are you tight with the big guy? Do you ahve some life experiences that would give me reason to question myself? If you do, I would love to hear them.

Or are you blindly putting faith in something that might not be?

Like I said earlier, everyone has to have something to beleive in.

Sorry Steve for all the religious retoric in your article

Eikonoklasmos

on Jul 22, 2004

Have you talked to God? Has he done something for you? Are you tight with the big guy? Do you ahve some life experiences that would give me reason to question myself? If you do, I would love to hear them.

Or are you blindly putting faith in something that might not be?

"Here's the thing," as SanctusBelle so self-righteously put it... "God's Way is the Only Way." Posing questions like yours that to a person of a monotheistic faith is like trying to convince a brick wall it's a bowl of Jell-O. Exhausting, aggravating, and utterly pointless. The entire purpose of the idea of blind faith as spewed forth by the major religious leaders of the world is to shape the masses into something easily molded, and easily led. I'm sure any "faithful" person could easily respond "Yes," to any of the questions above, and qualify their answer with astonishing amounts of religious rhetoric. "Yes, I speak to God on a daily basis. Yes, he's given me the knowledge that I am secure in His Love. Yes, I am close to My Lord. Yes, the everlasting Love that He offers is enough reason for you to question yourself." And, of course, "No, God is the One, and the only One. There is no other, and God is eternal in his existence. There is no question of Him 'not being.'" See how easy that was? It's impossible to make a faithful person question him/herself because true faith is considered a lack of questioning beliefs. Someone like Sanctus is just as dangerous as someone like Osama or Dubya (forgive me, Godwin), in that they have the full convinction of years and years of misled "faith" guiding their decisions.

I am a Buddhist. I have faith in the greater good of mankind. I have faith that one should live their lives to the fullest, and should only do that which is required to make others around you happy. I have faith that only by following the Eightfold Path can one attain enlightenment and self-actualization. Yet I don't go around forcing others to become Buddhists in order to make them happy. Nor do I go around preaching Buddhist precepts or teachings because I'm trying to "save" anyone. The faith I have is in myself and in the idea that people should be free to live as they please as long as doing so does not cause mental, physical, or emotional harm to others. Most importantly, I have faith that everything I know, everything I believe, is most likely WRONG, and that I should spend my life attempting to find out why. That is the difference between my faith and the blind faith of people like SanctusBelle.

And yeah, sorry for the religious rhetoric too. =/

Amitty

on Jul 22, 2004

Eikonoklasmo, you are my new hero for hte day

AndyBaker

on Jul 22, 2004

Eikonoklasmo, you are my new hero for hte day

Why not be your own hero for the day, or even a lifetime? Does it matter what other people think or say? No. Unless you make it matter. Enjoy the journey. It's fricken great!

How do you do double quotes, by the way, like that one in reply#22? I haven't sussed it out yet.

Andy

Amitty

on Jul 22, 2004

I'm not sure how to do double quotes either.

Andy, you are a tad bit confusing. I care what people think because most people do. I'm not saying it is right, but it is something that jsut is. I am trying to enjoy it Andy, tho, trust me

AndyBaker

on Jul 22, 2004

I care what people think because most people do. I'm not saying it is right, but it is something that jsut is

You're right my friend. Yet there will come a time when we won't need to care what other people think. If we consider the bigger picture, we learn that there is nothing to fear. There is only everything to accept. We're all in this together, and we're all as scared as each other. Until we learn that there's nothing to be scared about.

Life is beautiful, really. Trust it.

SanctusBelle

on Jul 22, 2004

I know God is real because He transformed my life.
Ex-gay camp? I’ve never heard of a more ridiculous concept. I certainly believe that by accepting Christ, many people have overcome homosexuality in their lives. But that’s not all. People have turned away from drugs, murder, adultery, and many other sins because of what Jesus did on Calvary.
I had a tough childhood too, Amitty. God never promised us an easy life. I lived a life of drunkenness and drugs and pre-marital sex. Then I decided that I needed to accept Jesus Christ as my savior. When you let Him take control of your life, He transforms you into a new creature. Your slate is wiped clean, sins erased. I still make mistakes every day. I’ll never be perfect. It’s impossible.
“…everyone has to have something to believe in.” You said it. Did you know that the innermost desire of your heart is to truly know your Creator? Your heart longs for a relationship with the Lord. God meant for it to be that way. He wants you to know Him.

“Therefore, id anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!”
2 Corinthians 3:18

Praise God the new has come in my life.
I do not write these things to condemn anyone, for I have no right to do such things. Only God does because only He is perfect. I write them to enlighten and encourage. My prayers are with you all.

AndyBaker

on Jul 23, 2004

Goodness Gravy, what's going on here? It's all fun and games.

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